Poorboys Black Hole ... a little help, please ...

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pjgh
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Poorboys Black Hole ... a little help, please ...

Post by pjgh » Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:34 pm

Guys,

I had now had some considerable success with this product - I have left the post below for prosperity. Please check out my later post for some positive comments. Thanks for the help, guys:
http://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk/forum/vie ... 3917#33917


I now have Poorboys Black Hole in my armoury. This evening was okay ... overcast, but not raining; just a little damp. I picked my usual test panel (the boot on my wife's convertible ... I bought the product for her car, afterall) and stripped off whatever was on it with some Car-Lack68 NSC.

Surface prepped, I applied the Poorboys Black Hole glaze as per the instructions with a foam applicator and spread it thinly and evenly, neatening up the finish with some long strokes and then removed the product. I didn't see a need to let it dwell, but I'll take advice on that. While applying, it left little pin-prick dots on the paint that smeared when rubbed ... you know, like Meg's #21 or #26. I removed the product and then buffed, but the finish was not good - neutered and actually milky on some angles :shock: I buffed some more and then applied some Meg's Speed Detailer QD and rubbed/buffed some more.

The finish was not good - when I breathed on the paint, the condensation left a very strange pattern where I could see all the striations in the paint. Undeterred, I proceeded to add a wax - I though Chemical Guys/DW Wet Wet Wet Wax would be the most compatible, to see if that lifted the finish. It made it worse :cry: I know how Chemical Guys/DW Wet Wet Wet Wax can make that car look and it was certainly problematic due to the glaze.

I started again ... Car-Lack68 NSC and applied the Poorboys Black Hole with a terry applicator and got much the same result, if a little worse. The foam applicator is the way to go with this product (well, it does say so :wink: ).

Wondering if my paint was the problem, I cleansed again :lol: Gotta love Car-Lack68 NSC :cool: I then applied Einszett Waxpolish Soft and was left with a lovely deep sheen. I then popped some Clearkote Carnauba Wax on (which I like on top of the Einszett glaze, which is a glaze despite it being called a "polish") and the glossy, slick finish was all there.

So ... I have a problem with Poorboys Black Hole. It doesn't want to play nice with me, or my car's paint which is single stage, BTW. I had assumed it was a colour-charged glaze with fillers and so would work quite happily with single stage as well as clearcoat.

What have I done wrong? How can I improve my technique? Hints and tips, please guys :wink:
Last edited by pjgh on Sat Nov 08, 2008 9:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

pjgh
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Post by pjgh » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:52 pm

... re-reading the instructions, it does say to "work until is shine is revealed" which I took to mean work until clear. I did that but it was really smeary with the rub lines visible as "shadows". Maybe I should have worked it longer? Maybe the air was too damp?

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Post by JohnC » Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:56 pm

There is a bit of a contradiction here:

"Poorboys Black Hole Show Glaze for dark vehicles is a wipe on, wipe off product. Spread with a soft, clean foam applicator. If applying by machine, set your polisher to a low speed and work until a shine begins to appear. Allow it to dry to a haze and then buff off with a clean, soft Cobra Microfibre Towel."

Wipe on wipe off but at the same time allow it to dry to a haze!

That is the only thing you could have done wrong Paul. I would say leave it on until it hazes and then wipe off. The weather may not have helped either since many sealant products do not cure well in the damp.

Since finding that Zaino doesn't hide any of the imperfections in my car's paintwork (and never having used a machine nor having the inclination to pay a lot to have my car machined) I am looking for a filler of some sort that I can put Zaino over. The finish is something very special but I would like it to be perfect from all angles in all lights. Black Hole was a product I was interested in as a base layer on top of which I might try to put Zaino. The simplest thing would be for Zaino to bring out a light filler product.

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Post by pjgh » Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:23 pm

That's right ... there is a bit of a contradiction, but actually, thinking it through it is possible to work it clear and then leave it to haze. Wipe on/Wipe off could easily mean "does not need to sit for half an hour" :wink: I'll have a go in clearer, dryer weather and report back. My other favourite products did not suffer the same problems tonight, though, but I know Meg's #21 or #26 (liquid wax) would have done the same. So ... leave it to haze ... I was maybe a little hasty, what with it being a new product to me, and all :twisted:

I bought this product exactly for the filling. I like AG SRP, but I have quite a thing for glazes and although AG SRP and Chemical Guys EZ Creme Glaze work well together, this looked like an all in one filler and gloss enhancer. I will reserve judgement until I have tried it in better conditions. Despite the cloud and misty rain, I was sweating really badly while cleaning this evening, so I presume humidity was very high, too.

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Post by RussST » Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:05 pm

Do you have a machine polisher pjgh? When I used BH, I applied it via PC on an SFX2 pad and the results were superb! The swirl filling properties aren't as apparent as SRP, but the depth and shine to the finish was a lot better.

John - the problem with using BH as a base layer, is that Zaino would have issues bonding to it, unless you put down a layer of ZCS then applied Z2P on top of it, but I'm not so sure how good that would be looks wise?

Why don't you get your car defect free?

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Post by pjgh » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:28 pm

RussST - I am working by hand, but don't think I can't rub like a machine ... I'm a great hulking bloke with huge shoulders :twisted: Do I just need to polish harder? I'll try again tomorrow if the air is drier and the wind has dropped a little.

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Post by lord melch » Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:29 pm

Try poorboysworld@att.net

Pretty quick response normally..
Cheers,
LM

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Post by pjgh » Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:12 pm

I'll fire off an e-mail to them - thanks.

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Post by pjgh » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:00 pm

Okay ... out with the AG SRP and gave the boot a polish (well, the whole car, but only the boot got the Poorboys Black Hole afterwards). Poorboys Black Hole on ... this time it worked ... and in the sun, too :cool: It left a nice glossy shine which I covered in Meg's #26 (liquid), regretted that due to it muting the finish*, wiped it all off ... and popped some Collinite 476S on top :cool:

Sorry ... this was the best picture I got today ... and the boot is all covered in dust now :(

Image
http://www.pjgh.co.uk/gallery_albums/sw ... CF8023.jpg


* Odd, since #26 does not seem to mute the stunning wet look that is left by #7 :?

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Post by mulder » Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:51 pm

You see, this is what happens when you mix your products :wink:

I've considered Poorboys but you know me, it was going to be Poorboys Polish with Carnauba Blue, Black Hole & Natty Blue Wax for the blue cars and Poorboys Polish with Carnauba, Diamond White & Natty Wax for the white.
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Post by pjgh » Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:21 pm

According to http://www.poorboysworld.co.uk :

"In addition to disguising blemishes, Poorboys Black Hole Show Glaze for Dark Vehicles cleans the paint. Swirls can be more noticeable when they’re filled with grime, so this special formula lifts out dirt and then fills in swirls with glaze. In just one quick step, your vehicle will be swirl-free, incredibly glossy, and slick!"

So ... my AG SRP layer was kind of pointless :roll:

Personally, I think of it very much like Autoglym Ultra-Deep Shine. I have heard a lot about Natty's Paste Wax, which would compliment this glaze very well. I wonder how Natty's might help protect AG UDS? I shouldn't think there'd be a problem, since it plays nice with the other paste waxes I have used. All things considered, Black Hole is probably not going to get much of an outing on my cars - I already adore #7/#26 and CG EZ Creme Glaze/DW Wet Wet Wet Wax. I'm glad I tried it anyway ...

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Post by pjgh » Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:30 pm

After a day, the car was a little dusty, so out with my Eurow towels and Meg's #135. Spray ... wipe ... buff ... buff hard and tonight, under street lamps, the boot looks really good. I'll see again in the morning. Aside from being a little problematic to apply (which was down to the weather and no doubt my technique with a new product) the results are great - certainly as good as AG UDS and CG EZG under the Collinite 476S wax. Looking at the swirl filling, it's not that miraculous, but plays nice with AG SRP to get it "just right" :cool:

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Post by pjgh » Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:46 pm

For the record, I had another go today ... I refined my technique a little and got a reasonable result. I used a lot less product (literally, a pea sized blob on a pad) and worked it a lot longer ... until it had gone clear, almost.

... leave to haze, buff off ...

Yup! That does the trick ... not very well in my opinion and no better than Autoglym Ultra-Deep Shine, which is an easier product to work with. Chemical Guys EZ Creme Glaze does a significantly better job on black and is a pleasure to work with. Meguiars #7 is soooo much better on my paint. YMMV :wink:

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Post by RussST » Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:09 am

I found it very easy to use, and have seen some staggering results with it topped with old SuperNatural.

Maybe you have a dodgy bottle, because it certainly sounds very different to the product which I used... just a thought.

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Post by pjgh » Sat Aug 09, 2008 2:00 pm

That is certainly a possibility - it is more probable that my paint being single stage leaves a very different finish to your paint, as well as the finish that I like to see being different to the finish you like to see. A lot of this comes down to personal preference and perhaps it's not quite my "cup of tea".

I think I might have been expecting more out of the product. I'll pass it onto a friend with a G220 and see how he gets on with it.

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